Swarf caps

[Toolmaker51]

...plans seekers are actually search bots....infernalnet intertwined with 1000's of search engines and key word loggers...wonder we each don't get requests for more things than we do.

Well, I know some don't get credit for what they DO to start with.
Or they don't when we do, just when were not.
Anyway, back to search bots...how do we re-program the drones in their direction? Eagles have better things to do too.

[Jon]

Agreed that the votes for plans requests are not 100% exact, and are probably closer to 50% exact. Some are bot clicks, some are just used as generic "I like this idea" clicks, some are someone's cat stepping on a keyboard, etc. This is true of any anonymous counting metrics on the web. This is why the "Thanks" method on the forum is so trustworthy; it's not anonymous, each thanking name is publicly displayed, and the thanks-es can be given and retracted at will.

If you count each plan request vote not as a single person formally entering a request for drafted plans, but as a generic "+", you can use it comparatively to see the trends. This will show you which of your tools are more-liked compared to others. The commenting feature on tool pages is helpful too.

Nevertheless, this is a fairly new feature; we're open to ideas on improving it.

[mklotz]

If the plan request is largely incorrect (in the sense that it reflects something other than a desire for plans) then folks contemplating the submission of plans will be discouraged which is counter to the forum's benefit.

If folks are using it as a pseudo "like button" then how to separate "likes" from genuine plan requests?

The "Thanks" method is indeed better - far better than the nearly ubiquitous "like" button. Maybe make plan requests work the same way as the "Thanks" method?

[Jon]

That's a valid point. There are a few knobs I can turn, including limiting that feature to logged-in users. We even have a few emails from people who think that clicking to request a plan should then immediately make the plans viewable to them. The "Want a plan" prompt isn't aligning with the user's intent. We also have a star rating feature accompanying each tool listing, which can be more frontloaded, or we can just combine both features into a "Like"; this is a plainer but more accurate way for the user to express opinion, and the builder to analyze it. I'll look further into this.

[Toolmaker51]

I agree with both Marv and Jon, I mis-cued a couple my self way back in the newbie days; if FEB counts as way back. No cat for an excuse; sometimes the dog drops tennis ball on laptop in use........ It would appear a portion of users liken 'our' set-up to common social media [of which I have no contact, save comments by others] that treats interaction like a game; instead of a communal response. Judgement lies on builders page, some longtime user names don't bring their game at all, and hence unfamiliar.
Even at 14,000 odd builders, that's no percentage = of where trips to the mall are news, bathroom selfies, or idlers haunt and stalk.

Jon says "There are a few knobs I can turn,......".
What I think needs twisting isn't knobs; although could be similarly sized.

[Jon]

Let me know if you guys have an idea for wording a single positive indicator, besides "Like". It's accurate, but I'd rather choose something less Facebook-ish. "Want" probably won't work; it's too indicative of some sort of potential future acquisition. Increasing the prominence of that star rating tool is also an option.

"Thumbs up", "Would you build this tool?", something like that, but worded concisely and presented cleanly.

[Jon]

Removed "Want a plan" text from tool pages, thanks for the input guys. We can figure out what to add in its place going forward, but the argument for removing it was strong enough to do so. Plans sales are working out nicely without it anyway

[C-Bag]

Jon for all you do to keep this place going. When you have folks from all over the world dropping in here from other sites with different expectations.......I wouldn't even want to try and ride herd here. Good thing it doesn't seem to bother you.

As one who doesn't make plans for anything I've ever made, I've watched the whole "plans" idea from afar. I would much rather provide details on a build from asked questions than try and make formal plans. Like Marv my interest is in the idea behind the post. The learning curve for me was seeing how folks explain and show the build more than the step by step. I get it can be hard to get how something functions from words and stills. I'm experimenting with those animated gif's as a way to bridge the gap between stills and full on vids you have to post to YouTube.

I'd not thought of the bot thing(good call Frank) as a reason for plan requests. I want to help folks out if they want it, but I also don't have a ton of time to spend doing something I'm not great at for no reason. Or for somebody who's attitude is I'm not doing enough or doing it right.... Good luck with all this Jon.

[PJs]

I'm with C-Bag on All that you bring to us here, Jon. Sincere thanks and a fine response to this small issue we were having fun with. Had no idea that Bots could push radio buttons (good one TM)! I'm sure you'll come up with an alternative to a plans request radio button with a Bot defender. Honestly I know it's a vigil just to keep up with all that's flying out there now. My Hat is Off to you and the HMT Crew!!

Marv, What was it your avatar said about Imagination? Keep'em coming, "it embraces the entire world"!

~PJ

[C-Bag]

Maybe make plan requests work the same way as the "Thanks" method?

This may truly be the crux of the biscuit right there. I'm not privy to all the stats but certainly Jon is and in a recent thread concerning how things were posted it was suggested that there was not enough detail overall in the posts. It was an ego thing of "look at my stuff" instead of an instructable. When it was suggested that they could ask questions it made them incensed they would have to ask. Was this a minority opinion?

But I tried to point out it seems there are a lot of "people"( are these bots too?) cruising the forums with a tiny % posting and even tinier interacting. So when your post doesn't get much views or interaction, why would it seem to get plan requests?

Probably too much belly button gazing.........