Hybrid truck recharges from overhead wires in Germany - GIF

[ToolTalkBot]

Hybrid truck recharges from overhead wires in Germany.




Previously:

1898 Henri Fournier hybrid motorcycle - photo
1901 Lohner-Porsche hybrid automobile - photo
HAV 304/Airlander 10 hybrid airship - photo and video
Hybrid combine animation - GIF

[Frank S]

we were doing the calculations on the upfront cost to charge an electric car that runs 100 miles every day by solar only.
First it takes 3 power walls then $12,000.00 for the solar panels plus installation and the converter. By the time all costs were figured in even an AI program on Bing said the upfront cost was $36,000.00 Factor in the price of the vehicle in my case it would have to be a pickup so say 65,000.00
Now were are at 101,000.00 if you paid cash for everything. The power walls figure to have a use life at the discharge rate required to recharge the truck after 100 miles every day of 5 years solar panel 10 years except we have large damaging hail every year so being conservative say five years the truck 36,000 per year 180,000 is not unreasonable but the battery will be shot the only thing left with use life after 5 years is the converter 100,000 miles would cost 56 cents per mile driven not including insurance registrations tires brakes and other incidentals.

Now look at a gas powered same class truck $40,000.00 , 5 years 180,000 miles driven 18MPG gas cost average $4.00 per gallon 10,000 gallons used $40,000.00
24 oil changes @7500 mile intervals $100.00 per change $2400.00 total $82,400.00 in 5 years and the truck will still be going again excluding tires brakes insurance registration I would expect I would average closer to 22 MPG with a 5-year average gas price of $3.50
But I'm still sticking with my 33 year old F350 diesel that still averages 18 MPG and it is enough truck to do something with even better you can't dent it with a marshmallow A base ball hit with a Louisville slugger maybe

[schuylergrace]

we were doing the calculations on the upfront cost to charge an electric car that runs 100 miles every day by solar only.
First it takes 3 power walls then $12,000.00 for the solar panels plus installation and the converter. By the time all costs were figured in even an AI program on Bing said the upfront cost was $36,000.00 Factor in the price of the vehicle in my case it would have to be a pickup so say 65,000.00
Now were are at 101,000.00 if you paid cash for everything. The power walls figure to have a use life at the discharge rate required to recharge the truck after 100 miles every day of 5 years solar panel 10 years except we have large damaging hail every year so being conservative say five years the truck 36,000 per year 180,000 is not unreasonable but the battery will be shot the only thing left with use life after 5 years is the converter 100,000 miles would cost 56 cents per mile driven not including insurance registrations tires brakes and other incidentals.

If you are on the grid, Frank, why would you want to invest in solar/battery solely to recharge a truck? While I think distributed power generation is where we are headed, we aren't really there, yet, and it's much more efficient for a big power company invest in a diversified suite of power sources with the economies of scale they can gain. I'm pretty sure you'd come out ahead in your calculations, and you wouldn't be emitting so many particulates and greenhouse gasses, if you simply installed a charger that was grid powered and did most of your charging off-peak (if you are on some sort of time of use plan).

[Frank S]

If you are on the grid, Frank, why would you want to invest in solar/battery solely to recharge a truck? While I think distributed power generation is where we are headed, we aren't really there, yet, and it's much more efficient for a big power company invest in a diversified suite of power sources with the economies of scale they can gain. I'm pretty sure you'd come out ahead in your calculations, and you wouldn't be emitting so many particulates and greenhouse gasses, if you simply installed a charger that was grid powered and did most of your charging off-peak (if you are on some sort of time of use plan).

This was just a what if, for a friend of mine. We also discussed the prospect of him removing himself from the grid and using his RV generator as the backup but without the EV vehicle,

a number of people have supposedly done studies about the cost differences in going EV charging from their home instead of gasoline vehicles even if you could garner a decent off-peak rate a full EV costs 2 to 2.5 times as much to operate than a gas powered one. due to the cost of electricity on many areas, and no matter how they try and pump the green thing there is nothing green about electrical energy without nuclear power generation. followed by natural gas as the backup co-generation
My friend owns a 2019 Ford hybrid thing non plug in that averages him 45MPG. Yeah, well OK I drove a VW diesel in Europe 15 years ago that averaged better than 60 MPG when you converted from liters Kilometers to miles and gallons, I drive it like I stole it. He only drives 55 MPH wherever he goes so he can keep his milage up.

[Floradawg]

I think the thought of Frank emitting particulates and greenhouse gases keeps him awake at night.

[Frank S]

I think the thought of Frank emitting particulates and greenhouse gases keeps him awake at night.

maybe that's my problem, and here I was blaming it on not wanting to wake up before 7 in the morning, so I stay up until 1 or 2 Am sometimes 3 am almost every night. I can now blame it on the greenies costing everyone more money LOL.

[schuylergrace]

I just ran the numbers through a couple of estimators and got a five-year payback for a Ford F150 King Ranch vs. a Ford F150 Lightning XLT Extended range based in the Phoenix, AZ, area (for power/fuel costs and tax rates). That includes financing, power/fuel costs, and maintenance costs, among others. As a benefit, EV owners get to use the HOV lanes on the freeways, which is a Godsend during rush hours, plus EVs contribute next to nothing to our horrid, smoggy air. I don't think EVs are for everyone, just like an F350 isn't for everyone, but they do have their place, and there's no stopping the transition from fossil fuels for automotive use to electric based systems. Besides, with all the uses we have for petroleum based products, from pharmaceuticals to AG chemicals to plastics, burning it for fuel will seem like a waste in years to come.

[Floradawg]

I just ran the numbers through a couple of estimators and got a five-year payback for a Ford F150 King Ranch vs. a Ford F150 Lightning XLT Extended range based in the Phoenix, AZ, area (for power/fuel costs and tax rates). That includes financing, power/fuel costs, and maintenance costs, among others. As a benefit, EV owners get to use the HOV lanes on the freeways, which is a Godsend during rush hours, plus EVs contribute next to nothing to our horrid, smoggy air. I don't think EVs are for everyone, just like an F350 isn't for everyone, but they do have their place, and there's no stopping the transition from fossil fuels for automotive use to electric based systems. Besides, with all the uses we have for petroleum based products, from pharmaceuticals to AG chemicals to plastics, burning it for fuel will seem like a waste in years to come.

Where do you think the electricity to charge them comes from? Coal, oil, and natural gas would probably supply most of it.

[Frank S]

I see the grid charged electric vehicles as merely a transitional phase in the next evolution of personal and commercial transportation. At least in the cesspools called cities. Which may even not be as long lived as people may think. Smaller tighter cities within these large cities will eventually come into being if several governments around the world have anything to do with it. The 15 minute cities seem to be on the rise where everyone lives within 15 minutes of their work.

There's no question that electric vehicle propulsion is probably here to stay, until a new source of energy is discovered. What that may be is only in the minds of Sci fi authors right now.
What I don't believe though, is the electric vehicles will primarialy receive their recharge from the grid. Currently the options to recharge them are limited three's wind but probably only if you live in remote rule areas and if the wind even blows. there's solar of course. the efferences of solar PV has greatly improved in that past several years but still probably less than 20% but you need quite a large area of coverage And apartment dweller in a high rise can forget that but most probably should be using public transportation anyway. Last is hybrid powered. Many manufactures are going to them and some going back to them but again as you said these currently require either fossil fuels or agriculturally produced which winds up taxing the already depleted soils requiring them to be heavily fertilized. most of the chemicals of which comes from petroleum. Methane capture form land fills could partially supplement as a fuel source for the hybrid vehicles . The Germans have been capturing and burring methane from land fills for 50 years. Or there is hydrogen, Hydrogen is actually not a bad way to go. it can be produced from many sources but currently methods of production consumes nearly as much energy as it can produce. Excepting from natural gas. elemental hydrogen is an energy carrier when burned it produces water

For long haul freight transportation a company in Canada i think. Makes something they call Edison trucks 'google them'. they are an electric powered truck with a diesel generator have reign. braking and a battery.
If anyone can successfully create brown's gas 'google it' without it requiring more energy to make than it produces then that could be an alternative.

[schuylergrace]

Where do you think the electricity to charge them comes from? Coal, oil, and natural gas would probably supply most of it.

Here, in Arizona, about half (46%) of our electricity is still generated by natural gas, but nuclear also is a major source (27%). Coal is fast dwindling, as coal fired plants and coal mines shut down, primarily because coal plants cost so much to operate and coal is an expensive and dirty fuel. Solar, in fact is outpacing coal now, and we generate a reasonable share from wind (fast expanding) and hydro.

In the U.S., as a whole, natural gas makes up about 43% of the supply, while coal still supplies about 15%, but that number is dropping quickly. Renewables are up to about 30%, while nuclear is around 10%. Natural gas is still being used because it's currently cheap and plentiful. Oil supplies only a fraction of a percent of all electricity production.