$10,000 bet for downwind faster than the wind - video

**Jon** · Jul 11, 2021, 02:51 PM

The irony here is that this demonstration had already been done, over 50 years ago, by an aerodynamics engineer whom nobody has heard of, named Andrew Bauer. The demonstration even included a bet, but for $1, not $10,000. Original paper: https://diqn32j8nouaz.cloudfront.net...-Interface.pdf

Here he is with the craft he built:

0:38 video of it in action:

There's nothing wrong with what Veritasium is doing. It's just interesting how this old demonstration got recycled into the public eye with a famous YouTuber, a Miss America contestant, a "science guy", and a "science communicator".

**FEM2008** · Jul 11, 2021, 05:56 PM

[QUOTE=Floradawg;184192]I realize the treadmill is a powered device but just think about it. If you place the vehicle on a smooth surface with no wind and push the vehicle as fast as the treadmill belt is traveling, the relative motion between the surface and the vehicle are the same. I bet $10,000 dollars the vehicle would not continue to travel much less accelerate.
Also, a mechanical engineer does not constitute a climate scientist or scientist of any kind in spite of learning some thermodynamics.[/QUOTE

I suppose we just should the arguments to the real climate scientists then: politician, talk show talking heads and armchair climatologists.

**jimfols** · Jul 11, 2021, 06:23 PM

The America's Cup boats could probably use a prop if it was wind powered.
This thread may awaken some aerodynamics engineer's history lesson.

**Floradawg** · Jul 11, 2021, 06:35 PM

Once something gets politicized it is a fruitless endeavor to try to have a rational discussion about it. This goes for climate change, covid, border control, you name it. There is some anthropomorphic warming occurring but not nearly at the rate most politically corrupted individuals would have you believe. If they had ever been right it would have already constituted a huge catastrophe. This is MY two cents worth and the truth is climate is so chaotic and the causes of the climate function depend on an incredible number of factors. I don't think anybody can reliably tell you what is going to happen with it over however many years. I've read several books on this subject and I'm convinced there is a whole lot of hokum being dished out.

**nova_robotics** · Jul 11, 2021, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by Floradawg

There is some anthropomorphic warming occurring but not nearly at the rate most politically corrupted individuals would have you believe.

You, me and a hundred other people are in an auditorium. There is also a tiger loose in the auditorium mauling people. What you just said amounts to "Well the tiger is natural and I didn't let the tiger out of the cage." Who cares? Shoot the damn tiger.

We've been reshaping the Earth to better suit us for centuries. I don't see why people are drawing a line in the sand on this particular issue.

**FEM2008** · Jul 11, 2021, 08:58 PM

Originally Posted by jimfols

The America's Cup boats could probably use a prop if it was wind powered.
This thread may awaken some aerodynamics engineer's history lesson.

I could not remember the vertical rotary sail are called (Flettner Rotor Sail), but I ran across this site while looking. Apparently, there is patent on the the design that is now used on "Land Yachts" as seen in the Veratasium video.

ROTARY SAILS WIND TURBINE POWERED BOATS CARS AND SAILING SHIPS

An article regarding Flettner Rotor sails: ROTARY SAILS WIND TURBINE POWERED BOATS CARS AND SAILING SHIPS

**FEM2008** · Jul 11, 2021, 09:02 PM

@ Floradawg: One of those book authors wouldn't happen to be expert Robert Kehoe?

**DIYSwede** · Jul 12, 2021, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by FEM2008

I could not remember the vertical rotary sail are called (Flettner Rotor Sail), but I ran across this site while looking.

After almost a century, these Flettner rotors are getting a 2nd chance right now on M/S Viking Grace for the Stockholm-Helsinki cruise line:
https://www.vikingline.com/the-group...ce/rotor-sail/

I seem to remember that this was even mentioned here before: Magnus effect rotary sail propels cruise ship - GIF

**jimfols** · Jul 12, 2021, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by FEM2008

I could not remember the vertical rotary sail are called (Flettner Rotor Sail), but I ran across this site while looking. Apparently, there is patent on the the design that is now used on "Land Yachts" as seen in the Veratasium video.

ROTARY SAILS WIND TURBINE POWERED BOATS CARS AND SAILING SHIPS

An article regarding Flettner Rotor sails: ROTARY SAILS WIND TURBINE POWERED BOATS CARS AND SAILING SHIPS

Thank you for the link.

**Floradawg** · Jul 12, 2021, 09:56 AM

Because certain people like me don't believe that there is a problem. Some of the zealots have stated that islands have already disappeared. Really? How much do you think sea levels have risen in the last 20 or 30 years? Do your own research. don't believe it just because that's what everyone is saying. Al Gore famously stated that in Miami fish are swimming in the streets. Of course he linked this to climate change. There's only one problem. After he said that some Miami residents said that when it rains a lot in certain areas that has often happened even in the past. As sea levels rise, which they can, we deal with it. People relocate. What do you think people in the past have done when any kind of condition has made it impractical to hang around a certain area. Once again this my opinion. You are entitled to yours as well. Unfortunately in the political arena it seems only one side is allowed to be heard.